STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Let's work through what we know so far about the midair collision above the Potomac River outside Washington, D.C., last night. It's a little bit before 9 o'clock. It's about 8:48 local time, to be precise. American Eagle Flight 5342 was coming in from Wichita, Kansas. Four crew members, 60 passengers on board. A regional jet, a smaller jet, a narrow-body jet on its way into Runway 33 at Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport at about 8:48 p.m. Also in the sky, a U.S. Army Black Hawk helicopter with three crew members aboard, three American soldiers on board. Sean Duffy, the newly confirmed secretary of transportation, tells us this morning about what he understands of that situation.
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SEAN DUFFY: This was not unusual with a military aircraft flying the river and aircraft landing at DCA.
INSKEEP: Not unusual, and here's what else had to say.
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DUFFY: The American Airline flight coming in to land was in a standard flight pattern as it was coming into DCA.
INSKEEP: A standard flight pattern. And we will mention again, Runway 33. There are three different runways at Reagan National Airport, relatively constricted space, as major airports go. But three different runways, three different flight patterns, but this was one of the standard patterns. Somehow, those two aircraft collided. Video shows an explosion. We're told that the airplane ended up inverted and in three pieces in the Potomac River. The helicopter also went down. And John Donnelly of D.C. Fire tells us that they now believe there are no survivors after spending the whole night in the water, in the frigid water, where there was some ice today and last night, finding no sign of survivors.
And we have word of who some of the people on these aircraft were. U.S. Figure Skating say that a number of athletes and coaches and family members were returning from an event in Wichita, Kansas. And in a related bit of news from the Kremlin in Moscow, we're told that a number of Russian skaters and, we're told, other Russian citizens were among the 64 people on that plane. Now, the people who spoke at a news conference earlier today include one of the United State's senators for Virginia, Democratic Senator Tim Kaine. And he is on the line. Senator, thanks for joining us on a busy morning.
TIM KAINE: Absolutely, Steve.
INSKEEP: What do you feel you are learning about this incident so far?
KAINE: Well, I mean, just first, it's just such a tragedy. And as we wait for the news about who was on the plane, you know, we kind of wait with a sense of dread. It's a small community. There's going to be a lot of people from Virginia and D.C., probably people that we know or have some connections to - obviously, the folks from Wichita, Kansas. I think about my two senate colleagues, Senator Marshall and Senator Moran, who I know are very focused on this.
We got a lot of questions about how this would happen. Those of us who live here, we know how complicated and congested an airspace this is. You have commercial flights. You have military flights. You have, you know, the president being flown on Marine One from Andrews into the White House often. So it's a congested airspace with some special rules, but a number of us have been sounding the alarm about congestion for some time. The good news is the National Transportation Safety Board does have a very, very good reputation for conducting these investigations. And we believe we will get the answers about what happened, and we may get some answers soon.
INSKEEP: Let's talk a little bit about the congestion that you mentioned. One thing that is often on my mind, I think about it often when flying in - when arriving back in Washington, D.C., on a flight, the planes take a particular pattern. They stay over the river so as not to go over landmarks, which I think is a change...
KAINE: Yep.
INSKEEP: ...Since 9/11, is that right?
KAINE: Yes, it was a change both occasioned by 9/11 but also a little bit to reduce noise in neighborhoods. So that puts the flight paths mostly over the river.
INSKEEP: OK. And you said you had concerns about congestion broadly. What are those concerns? Lay them out for me.
KAINE: Well, just the - this is an airport, as you know, Steve, it's on a pretty tiny footprint. And it was originally built with the thought that these runways could handle about 15 million passengers in and out a year. The number of passengers in and out of Reagan National is now well in excess of 20 million a year. And so those of us who represent the region have often tried to make the case that, listen, we've got a couple of other airports here. BWI in Maryland, north of D.C., Dulles Airport west of D.C. Let's spread the traffic out among the airports because this congestion issue has been a concern.
Another concern has been, do we have enough air traffic controllers? We did an FAA reauthorization bill last spring, and one of the drivers of that bill was shortages in air traffic controllers. We don't know whether congestion or air traffic control was an issue in what happened last night. And it's important not to pre-judge, not to speculate. The NTSB will give us the answers. But we've been on the record for some time sounding the alarm about congestion and hoping that an event like last night would not occur.
INSKEEP: We'll just note, air traffic controllers - federal employees making life and death decisions. And they were involved last night in communication with the aircraft last night and seemed, according to one recording, to have indicated to the helicopter and gotten communication from the helicopter that they saw the plane. Somehow, they did not manage to avoid each other. When you mention congestion, Senator, I will note that traffic in recent days, recent months has, in fact, increased at Reagan Airport. There was an announcement last year that they were adding a number of new flights. Did you raise objections even about that?
KAINE: Yes, strong objections. And, you know, again, there have been flights added. The Wichita flight was not one of the ones that has been added in recent years. But, you know, we want people to have a good traveling experience, and Reagan National is a convenient airport to downtown. I get that. But, you know, at some point, you just have to worry about the congestion. Congestion already is causing significant delays at Reagan National. It's got one of the worst delay records around, and that is because of this congestion factor. And so, whether it's passenger convenience, passenger safety, the safety of crew - I mean, four crew members lost their lives last night in addition to the 60 passengers, in addition to the three soldiers. So again, the NTSB will get to the bottom of this. And they'll give us an answer. But I just continue to worry about the congestion issue.
INSKEEP: And I guess we should note - you mentioned the NTSB. The National Transportation Safety Board has investigators. Sometimes it takes them months or years to nail down a conclusion. We do not know that congestion was a cause of this or a contributing factor even, but we know that it is a factor. It is a reality of that area.
KAINE: Yeah. And the NTSB was on the site this morning. I was there at 6:30. They are there. They lead the investigation, and we have high confidence in them.
INSKEEP: Senator, it's always a pleasure talking with you. I'm sorry to be doing it on this occasion, though, but thanks for your time.
KAINE: Appreciate you reaching out, Steve. Thanks.
INSKEEP: The United States Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia. We'll continue to bring you more as we learn it. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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